Breath and cold exposure (more on this here) meet at a simple point: the body learns through direct experience. When the breath steadies under pressure, the mind receives a different message. When cold becomes measured rather than chaotic, resilience becomes trainable.
Transcript grouped by minute marker. Each timestamp opens the source video at that moment.
hi I am dr. Caroline leaf and welcome to another episode of cleaning up the mental mess a podcast dedicated to helping you take back control of your mental health and life get ready for an amazing episode and one of my favorite interviews ever in this episode I interview the incredible Iceman wim HOF on how we can train our minds to overcome any obstacle and literally change the chemistry in our bodies we'll share some amazing breathing tips why we should take cold showers how he overcame his wife's suicide and so much more this is an episode you are going to want to listen to a few times and share with everyone you know when I've got his nickname the Iceman by breaking a number of records related to cold exposure his feats include climbing Mount Kilimanjaro in shorts running a half-marathon above the Arctic Circle in his bare feet and standing in a container wall covered with ice cubes for more than a hundred and twelve minutes he has also achieved 21 Guinness World Records having embraced the majestic force of nature Wurm resolved to share his discovery with the rest of the world he is convinced that everyone can tap into this potential without having to invest the same decade's worth of study travel and daring and so he developed the wim HOF method a natural pass to an optimal state of body and mind woman's motto is what I am capable of everybody can learn with his wim HOF method he teaches people from all over the world including celebrities and
the world including celebrities and professional athletes to control their bodies and achieve extraordinary things if you enjoy my podcast and want to know how you can help me continue making them possible please consider subscribing wherever you listen and leaving a five-star review and please continue sharing this podcast with friends family and on social media before we begin this episode I want to check in with all of you how are you doing how are you holding up at a time like this it's vital to focus on your mental hygiene and health anxiety stress worry fear all of these can really weaken your immune system and affect how your brain functions if you find you are studying with your mental health or you just can't seem to feel happy then it's time for mind management it's time to detox your brain that's where my new 21 day brain detox app called switch comes in it's designed to help you find and eliminate the root of whatever is causing your mental distress and help you replace it with a new healthy neural network and habits it's just five steps that you do each day for 21 days and will take you about 15 to 30 minutes this is a daily mind management plan to manage your toxic stress the program has over 30 years of research backing it up and just went through clinical trials again with amazing results and right now a three-month subscription is on sale for 50% off just go to the switch or look
50% off just go to the switch or look for switch on your brain on iTunes or Google Play the link will also be in the show notes Verma Hoth what an absolute honor and a thrill to have you talking to me today being interviewed on my podcast I cannot tell you what a huge fan I am of yours plus my whole family they're all so excited that I'm interviewing you I was first introduced to you by my son-in - law a couple of years back and I was mentioning to you just before we started the interview was I was actually in Australia preparing to go and give some neuroscience lectures my son-in - law said Caroline you've got to listen to this film off end so I started listening to your sort of what your TED Talks and listening to you and I got so distracted I was ended up listening to you instead of preparing for my conference possibly Caroline and thank you very much for having me on your podcast great this is going to be a great conversation possibly in Australia you were more relaxed done you know that's that's what you get if you are distracted you are not engaged with the the possible trigger of stress coming up on a being on stage and having to say this is it covered you got my subject completely dominated is it there what is the entrance and what is there wave my dress looks like all those things they are not there at that moment so thus as you say it doesn't create a cell biological stress and so you get on
cell biological stress and so you get on stage and you are just there boom ours and that's the way yes I always begin when I get on stage I just follow my breath and I do that consciously and with that I'm like blank when I go on stage I'm like a little child I got no content I got no charge I'm just there and then I feel the crowd I feel the energy of all those humans and it gets into me and because I'm like in blank like transparent like empty I'm a mirror and then I am very able to interact with that and to have it like a cold eye is bad because that is also stressed a cold ice bath is stressed I've learned to go in without torch just have the body there and let it adapt because the body knows what to do but you have to let the body do what they body is able to do and then the stress suddenly is very well adapted to and you don't feel pain you do because pain is a messenger that you are interfering with some processes when we are in immediate danger than directly there is adrenaline you don't even feel pain yes amaze me that is not going on when we interfere in our brain with a deep
we interfere in our brain with a deep brain when we need it and that that is the problem of nowadays people in the world they don't they have disconnected thoroughly and not exercised their neurological pathways to their deep brain at will and they don't know how to shut up and to let back and they do or what the body is capable and with that the brain as you say and then there is paranoia then there's panic then there is fear and fear then is the message you because you are interfering with a possible a perfect adaptation to a stressful situation answering to the situation we have disconnected from those areas of the brain and recently I've shown how to connect with those parts of the brain thought of inaccessible by humans so we changed the paradigm only we need to do it with a group of people in brain scans and then we are able the professor's there they say after looking in with the brain scan a result they say this is a transformational technique that will change mental healthcare well you know mental healthcare that is based medicines and pills on dependency on exogenous drugs while we have the e made capacity within us a possible capacity
capacity within us a possible capacity to tackle stress in any way with that sense of control do we have lost through our comfort zone behavior all the way at our lifestyles etc they do not exercise the depth of our brain and thus we lost the connection and so when I go on stage I'm empty when I go into the cold water I'm empty when I do all these records I make sure my body is ready and my mind is not interfering and that is control of the mind is learning how to let go and then suddenly you're able to do so much movement and you become very confident that fills your being your psyche its neurology it's confidence is pure neurology it's the ability to know how to shut up when danger comes in and the body needs to act and adapt to the stressor and inoculate it so there we are that is a great introduction and we're gonna unpack all these incredible things that you've said and you know I just I get so excited because I can he you saying what I've been saying for 38 years that we can use our mind to control our body and it's something as you said so clearly that we have got so we've actually got so lazy with our thinking that we've adapted and we've got we think oh I can't do it and I can't control the sim
can't do it and I can't control the sim you feel controlled by external things and in the work I do is also in mental health obviously because it's when you deal with mind you dealing was with all the issues related to whether it's a learning disability the main share people it's a Toma whatever that's all starting with how am I going to use my mind in the situation I can't control the events and circumstances but I can control my reactions so I'm so so excited about the work that you're doing because you've taken it's from a different angle but to a whole new level so well let's just start at the beginning because most people have heard of you I mean for someone who has actually is the hold of over 26 world records and known as the Iceman and you've gone through so many challenges with your wife's suicide with people not believing you initially and now you've got all these scientists backing you you have the most amazing amount of wisdom besides the technique that you've developed and the and what you've shown we can do with our mind you have so much wisdom about life as well so could we start by you just telling us a little bit about yourself that's maybe not in your bio and why are you doing what you do and what motivates you and what got you where you are today yes very nice of you to say that all and very good alter yeah in life but I was born in a family of nine and nine children Catholic parents and we had very little money when back then and is about 55 years ago and the times were different and my father could not work because he had seven years in his back and in those times you got you received a very little amount of money just to
a very little amount of money just to survive and there was old man and many children must be is a favorite hobby occupation on whatever here I was part I was in the middle of that family number five so four before me and four after exactly in the middle if you don't man so middle a little man but I could not learn so good cognitively in the school and as we where poor family the ones who could really good learn well and good and may have a great result we're able to go to higher education than University then get a degree and to save us all from this poorness you know that whoa they're beasts yes the respect was a school results and who's got the best results we put him on a pedal stone he's the best he is the best he's the best and that got me sir pressed in my youth so I was down in the Yaqui I was there yeah I come along whim wimpy your knives okay but they're not so important and you don't get as much attention as from others and yes attention love care you know you just hop along there and it's okay I love my parents I love my brothers and sisters I love them all mm-hmm but back then I offered also it
mm-hmm but back then I offered also it made me Tim it made me go were being introverted but then I watched one of the identical twins I almost died at birth suffocated the fault of the whole I was being born and my mother invoke ated Oh God let this child live I will make him a missionary here he is Wow exact of the my Nana took many years but so many more like your South Carolina 38 years of believing of one a direction of the power of the mind to be the answer for so many people and so and like a treasure and everybody of us but we don't open the treasure box and we don't dig for the truth of that because the power of the mind will be their future I will get back to that thing is where I came from his long-term belief that that there is more than meets the eye I was identical twin and almost died so I was sort of traumatized coming to this world and this really had a big influence on my life the do we were identical I was quite different they're my twin brother and made me when I was 12 years and maybe I was not into cognitive results too much but at 12
cognitive results too much but at 12 years I know I knew a lot of Indu ism Buddhism psychology because that does where my hobbies and then yoga in those times it was nothing it was strange it was ridiculous moves and breathing techniques now that doesn't exist it was a time of Maharishi Mahesh Yogi who was the first and with a beard coming from the east looking mystical which took my attention meditates you know twice a day 20 minutes just following a mantra which makes you try and queal within they took it all they the philosophers the mysticism but until 17 years and I had already arrived at a whole lot many books and debated much and philosopher at much when it was yes yes and that is be it's not necessarily because of the cognitive or results in the school and all that and or intellectual interest it was ignited through the trauma which I did not know where it came from because it happened when I was really sort of unconscious I mean I was a little nothing coming out of my mother like purple and almost suffocated in a cold overhaul that's that's the way I came to the world with an invocation that I was going to be a missionary there for God's sake I don't know what happened but that nut had made my psyche yes yes it does
nut had made my psyche yes yes it does as you know words can they really have power a lot really power but we have never learned in the school to take that on mm-hm what I advocating now is to bring it to primary schools that we are able to make our bodies within control happy strong and healthy happy through control of the endocrine system the hormonal system that is healthy through control much deeper over the immune system I will explain all later extract the control of mitochondrial energy activation of molecules producing molecules that is power that is strength that is energy you can reduce so much more energy much more deeper control over your health and health systems and absolute control over your hormonal system which is much control control over your mood we have shown this now in the latest study how to do that sorry to interrupt you this is incredible this information I just want to reinforce something and ask you as well that you talk about your experience as brilliantly as when you were born and you know people often don't realize you are yes you were you can't quite remember that moment but it embedded in your brain and in every cell of your body but you took that energy that could have been traumatic and you and being one of nine children being the first child turn nearly dying at birth and you channeled that energy into learning
channeled that energy into learning about the deeper meaning of life and from an from a young age you were studying philosophy and meditation and so you learned and that's the point I want to make is that mind I I always tell people that we use our mind to learn how to manage your mind it's a learning process it's a skill that you develop and that's what you saying is wrong it's a skill it's not just gonna be it's something automatic we have to train ourselves to tap into the power of what our mind actually has exactly and that it is and I've done that through intuition through trauma and then through feelings like intuition and instinct because when you have experienced trauma and you don't know where it is what it is at it right then the only thing you can depend on is your feeling so you you go intuitively to those areas within yourself to connect with the those blockages fears inhibitions trauma and try to solve it to try to get a conscious control over that and that's exactly what you say and now we found a way how to do it oh wait a min my beautiful amazing yes what a ridiculous cute little being we are the protectors of the all the children of the world and that's the way we have to turn ourselves it's called love it's a can and we should be able to
love it's a can and we should be able to guarantee happiness strength and health to all our children in the world none of them excluded the mother in Baghdad is the same as in New York they just want prosperity through control guaranteed control over the a happiness strengthen out the war will subside the grieving craving for money and power will subside because a happy man doesn't grateful power exactly we be lost a ability and that's what you said very nice very effective and a direct we have to learn to control the power of our own mind we are not in control over our mind and the old scriptures that say they might not any control humor Stena me if it isn't control it's your greatest ally we should start in the primary school to teach our children to be in control over our immune system that which is the health and children I still got this connection about the mood they still get this irrational drive to live and to express themselves we should not be on them we should teach them how to tap in and to become conscious of their own neurological development I totally agree with you mmm I totally agree with you we should start young we shouldn't be waiting until we've hit a crisis in our midlife or something before in our 20s or something before we start this this needs to be a teaching children to manage their mind and
manage their mind and over body should start as you say very early so now you are telling us about how you are meditating twice a day that from the age of 12 and then by the age of 17 you were really like quite experienced in understanding the benefits of breathing and meditation and then how did you get you the voom HOF method today how do you beat how do we go from age 17 to where you are today we are now scientifically proving that this is effect yes the breathing was not around Anna it wasn't existent breathing techniques and those times I learned how to breathe first through going into cold water what do you do when you go into cold water learn to breathe deep and that is an automatic reflex to change the biochemistry inside that's why we take deep inhales is to regain force through biochemical chains and I did that in the in cold water autumn actually I did that like 20 25 30 breaths and very soon I was able to prolong my retention that means not breathing under the ice for five to seven minutes that is a control through the breath over the chemistry inside the body while even big stress is going on I mean stress in the end is cell biological stress and stress that come from many angles like mental stress
come from many angles like mental stress emotional biological thermal stress and many other ways of stress but in the end it all results in cell biological stress and we don't know how you with that consciously anymore because we always avoid stress we live in a comfort zone behavior and our mind is conditioned therein and thus at the moment when there is real really a danger go known like now with the rotavirus part empal we don't know what to do yeah and the economy is flattened lockdowns everywhere everybody is scared nobody knows X what to do I tell you the damaging effect of the corona virus is the innate immune system response the inflammation the body being flamed particularly if with the corona virus in the lungs so but it is inflammation and inflammation when you break it down to chemical symbols it it is the interleukin number six interleukin number eight mostly which is causing the inflammation and we in 2013 we have shown the first time in science after being injected with an E coli bacteria which is also causing inflammation in the body to bring down the aisle 6 to bring down the aisle
the aisle 6 to bring down the aisle number 8 I'm trying to tell the whole world hey doctors wake up we found a way to dampen absolutely to surpress the interleukin number 6 and ATM diem de flam Ettore markers within the body which is causing the damage in corona virus I don't know exactly in what stages at all exactly is working because that normally takes a scientific research but there is no time but we did already published in the best of scientific papers but the PNAS and the nature to it also over that we got into the autonomic nervous system related to the innate immune system response yeah huge so that is huge and they shoot there is a fire going on and I say I got a tank full of water what do you want me to do yeah gosh okay well you know what we've got an ideal opportunity on this pod cause I have a big following and I know people are moving daily we are putting out support and help for people with a pandemic and in terms of mind I do all kinds of mind challenges so what could you suggest if I know it's a little bit of our diversification but in terms of the VAM HOF method and people coping today what could you walk us through your technique could you advisers and that'll be a great way for people to start understanding what you're talking about and then we can dive into the science of what's
dive into the science of what's happening in the brain and the body as they apply your method would you do that yeah of course what people should do in these times is bring down willfully because when you do breathing techniques it's you who is doing this a zebra is not doing this the monkey is not doing this elephant doesn't do this we do this because we go into consciously changing the biochemistry in the body by manipulating through breathing techniques in the chemistry of the body we are say the alchemist everybody is in our possible alchemist directly and so I'll keep it simple and keep it straight is put this under your podcast for people to go to our website there is a free app there's a free app I'm working right now to endorse this I'm working right now with Professor Elissa Appel from the University of San Francisco she's a top researcher on the DNA we are doing a research right now with them and she knows that time now as she is a DNA researcher that she knows about inflammation and how it all works on the genomes and like yourself and she is a top researcher she works together with the Nobel Prize winner and on the DNA they are big time so they are weeping with me and I take any opportunity to bring it out and I challenge any doctor
bring it out and I challenge any doctor and feel it yourself feeling is understanding more hello the protocols of the app the free app on the wim HOF method dot-com and you will feel what I want to understand then because there is fire going on there's anxiety people don't know what is going on people don't know how to dampen the innate immune response they don't know how to tackle disease in general they don't know because they lost this connection as we talked over in the beginning already lost these connections inside our own brain we actually do not own our own brain because we are never schooled there in the neurological pathways are not there but they can be there within a half-hour hour of training in this and there you feel completely different just use the app in this time you bring down anxiety and you want to bring down the innate immune response do you want that then take on the app because it's going to work we'll put that in the show notes so people can access that so these are basic step by step procedure they a simple one for them to start controlling their immune systems through breathing through the wim HOF method ok perfect that's wonderful and all of your links will be putting in the show notes so people will be able to access everything that you're
be able to access everything that you're doing and the research and everything which is fantastic ok so maybe we should explain to people what the wim HOF method actually is and what are the benefits and how do you which is related to this question just like an outline of what it is and how you do it and then let's dive into the science of the impact of it so the Weymouth method consists of three pillars the pillar number one is the gradual adaptation to cold that is a vascular training cardiovascular training we do through taking a 30-second cold shower and extend it to two to three minutes and save in a period of 10 days that means your vascular system is able to absolutely adapt to that cold within 10 days case and optimize optimize the vascular tone and with that the transportation system of hours of our blood that is the vascular system will then be optimized and the blood will run a much better through the flexible veins arteries and capillaries and with that comes the millions of little muscles in the vascular system are being stimulated they work then with the blood flow system then the heart rate goes down with 20 to 30 beats a minute 24 hours a day that means stress will go away stress
that means stress will go away stress will cortisol will be ignited through a high heart rate and that is constantly there and that takes a lot of energy and it ignites and activates the sympathetic nervous system which in the end we have no energy left anymore because we do not get into restoration parasympathetic nervous system activity and those body is not getting into arrest and rehabilitation of energy and chemical processes so a cardiovascular workout is a shower between 30 seconds and 2 and a half minutes I always say a cold shower a day keeps the doctor away just to keep it simple that is pillar number one mm-hmm no pillar number two is the breathing breathing is everybody briefs but most of us because we wear clothes we live in a D stimulative behavior and that makes our breathing shallow if we want it yes or no it happens there is no exertion going on so the breathing becomes shallow because there is no inoculation of stressful environment going on so it becomes a little like there's peace but there is not really peace when because you're a deep breathing also stimulate the neurology your immune system and
the neurology your immune system and all so when viruses and bacteria come or you have immune system that doesn't is not alerted so much because there's never deep breathing going on then it doesn't detect the cells are not well fat they are not alerted they don't react on the incoming bacteria and or viruses and what we have shown in 2013 to be able to go through the breathing into the innate immune system response as well as activating the specific immune system which is a deeper layer of the immune system which deals with bacteria and virus directly it doesn't wait the bacterial virus do not need to make the body in fever and inflammation no it deals directly at the core at the beginning are you talking there about the T and the P cells in the bone marrow being released when you access the deep flood the lymphocytes note builds leukocytes the T cells the B cells all that is gone or we breathe as deep and that is logical because in the end the breath goes into the blood and the blood reaches the bone marrow but when the blood flow is poor is not so good then it's it doesn't go to the outskirts of our body when one of them is the bone marrow is
is the bone marrow is too far to reach so the body naturally goes into hey let's survive survive let's adjust the liver and then the heart and the brain and the lungs and if we give the blood over there and that's it and an arrest is being extradited like it's not important to sacrifice it makes our immune system specific immune system like lazy not dormant isn't it when the blood doesn't reach over there it is torment and how it precisely works is a full book we could write upon that because it is a truth it is a fact and now deep-breathing enables us to get into the T cells to be cells or leukocytes the white cells and the rat cells and all older cells isn't that amazing it's incredible so if I'm hearing you saying just for the sake of my listeners reinforcing what you said because it's so incredibly powerful when we take the most basic physiological function that keeps us alive which is breathing which we all do all the time or you did if you breathe correctly if you breathe in such a way where you're actually challenging your body you're gonna push the oxygen right into the bone marrow and that's going to activate the T and the P cells plus the other cells of the immune system which wouldn't ordinarily be activated sufficiently for your body to embrace all the activities of the immune system that are there to help us facilitate healing so by breathing you are activating and that's this natural
activating and that's this natural process in your body by deep breathing not just shallow breathing not just basic breathing that we've adapted in our very comfortable environment but challenged breathing were you almost like I think yeah maybe you can do it walk us through a breathing exercise we people can experience the fact that you actually almost have to be out of breath in order to get to this depth of where you challenge the immune system to respond in this way have I understood that and explained that correctly yes the Nobel prizes are recently as been given to doctors who have shown that hypoxia like controlled hypoxia is actually very good against a lot of diseases it it relates to party wrecked with a lot of immune cells which are going to work a lot better and thus it tackles a lot of problems with a lot of cancers and out immune diseases because of hypoxia now what we do in our breathing techniques is to learn people within a half hour I mean it doesn't take long it is an innate possible control which we can have over our chemistry within up till the bone marrow so hey take I would say take it on guys it's there and find out and please tell me that I'm wrong but first experience do not just talk because in talking we don't tackle coronavirus we we tackle Corona iris by becoming immune by learning how to trigger the immune system who so well
to trigger the immune system who so well that we are able to tackle virus and bacteria at the beginning of their incoming day that would be great isn't it actually yeah we are sure we have showin this button now Caroline the deep breathing Trudy's the free app everybody can experience they only have to listen to us we talk you as a neuroscientist like me as an experienced did pick through science and having done so many will records I've gone in nature nature is my books nature I passed my examinations color death in nature and I came back with that knowledge from nature to put it in the books to change fundamentally science as it is because it hasn't and got the real answers to the pandemics and the will come more pandemics and people should learn how to ignite their immune system their specific immune system book as they are that is possible that is what to is consciousness now the neurology of consciousness this is your food this is your third pillar isn't it the commitment the consciousness is this your third pillar you talking about okay the third pillar if I'm able and to the show in brain scans to activate the deepest part of my brain without breathing techniques without muscle contraction then it's done only by thinking by setting the
done only by thinking by setting the mind learning to set the mind being able to connect with the deepest of my brain consciously and make cold water coming to the skin on my chest my skin temperature does not go down that is the power of your mind your power of your mind where you learn about this and we can teach this easy this is what I taught these people within four days in the hospital how to inoculate bacteria how to activate the immune system all at through breathing techniques and mind-set people have to learn to understand the new paradigm of say the placebo is the power of the mind but this time according to Professor music who stated that in the new book of Scott County investigative journalist who had to debunk me but became a great fan and he is a New York Times best seller a couple of times and now he wrote a new book the wedge and in the wedge professor music states Webb is a neuroscientist as well as an immunologist and some more titles he is a real I mean he is a real senior in this and these states in the book he says wim HOF has found the secret of placebo that means I know consciously how to use the power of thought to
how to use the power of thought to manipulate the body it is psychology over physiology and people only have to become aware hey listen oh it the first time somebody was running below ten seconds in next and here after about ten people we're running below - it's in the mind mmm I can't agree with you more Oh totally you eat listen you're speaking to someone who's totally supports you 100% it is the mind it's everything starts with the mind so even the decision to breathe properly the decision to get into the call your other pillars your mind is undergirding all of it because you have to get your mind right to actually be prepared to actually take this leap of faith and get into that cold water your first pillar and to do the breathing in the way that you teach it's it's a decision of your mind and then you've got then you take your mind to another level with your third pillar so yes I'm totally totally and that's what my research has been showing that you use your mind to train your mind and in that way you can control your reactions absolutely and the thing is that we know it now but we have to bring this to the awareness to the neurology - the perception the consciousness of people so this podcast is going to serve that Allah more people and cameras have where yes are aware of a innate capacity of themselves within the mind to be able just by thought to learn to control process in the body to inoculate stress
process in the body to inoculate stress to get a better hold over emotions over feelings in general over biology biological stress through virus and or bacteria etc it's a point for contemplation point or meditation point for consciously become aware creating a neurological pathway strong like a cable and when you need it you can use it and it's amazing how it works that is the power of the mind looking for something productive to do while in quarantine well you know I always recommend making building your brain a part of your routine brain building is one of the best ways to improve your mood cognitive flexibility boost imagination and creativity and help reduce anxiety and depression so how do you build your brain read and one of the best ways to read and learn and grow is by using bling cursed my favorite way to get more reading done blinkers takes the best key takeaways the need-to - know information from thousands of non-fiction books and condenses them down into just 15 minutes that you can read or listen to blinkers is made for busy people like you who want to get the main points of a book quickly so you can start using that information right away and with its audio feature blinkers makes it easy to finish a book or you clean your house exercise or my personal favorite while
exercise or my personal favorite while you go for walks with blinkers to get unlimited access to read or listen to a massive library of condensed nonfiction books all the books you want for all for one low price right now for a limited time blinkers has a special offer just for our audience go to blinkers comm slash doctor leaf try it free for seven days and save 25% of your new subscription that's plinkus spelled b link2cell cast comm slash doctor leaf to start your free 7-day trial and you'll also save 25% off but only when you sign up at blinkers comm slash doctor leaf the link will be in the show notes can you tell us a little bit more about the third pillar when you talk about the what are your sort of mind what are you doing with your commitment pillar the mindfully just a little bit of an overview yes so when I was in Michigan in Detroit to do the brain scans and to do this study where 74 people were not able to do just by the power of their thought bring down or maintain body temperature at a neutral level while being exposed to cold water on their skin and only being able to use the mind if nobody was able to do anything the skin temperature went down when cold water was being exposed to and it went
water was being exposed to and it went up again when a warm water was coming in so and then I came in and when I did nothing with my mind my skin temperature just went down and my skin temperature went up when wound water was coming up coming in again so but then day three I had to show what the Iceman is able to do now really I had no clue about what I was going or needed to do a day to me but they said you'll have to go and now make the difference and show what the Iceman is capable of Oh by using only the mind in the brain scan while being exposed to cold water on your skin and Anna I began to think that morning I was sitting there at half-past five and just being today I have to show different completely different and although 74 test subjects who all show to have no control through the mind over their skin temperature while being exposed to cold water so I have to show different hmm they told me I'm the Iceman what is this so I began to contemplate with him and to sink in and I found myself a Sully I got the images that I was among other is the mushers and I lost the way there was a wideout I was just a my shirts there no guide completely lost and I had no
guide completely lost and I had no paranoia I felt great actually like yes like so many more situations of those came to my mind at that moment there in Detroit looking over D destroyed in the morning in genuine wear ruby just people going to university at 10 o'clock to do the brain scans and show the difference so I add more of those situations experience coming back to my mind what was the principle set your mind set your intention that's what I always did when I went into nature and now I did not get had to go into nature I had to go into a very controlled environment with brain scan fMRI in a dark room and there I am and there I have to produce what I have produced before in nature and in nature I always prepared myself by feeling can I do this this can I climb Mount Everest in my shorts and I just felt it I felt the excitement and okay let's do it and I I did it to the death though and it was I just had a great experience and 26 of these World Records and so many more challenges always the same setting of the mind the power your intention pairs with feeling when you're feeling
pairs with feeling when you're feeling is okay you can do it if I had to ask you like extreme temperature cold temperature in the situation that you were facing going into the fMRI machine and having to reproduce what you'd experience in nature that really what you say days that you set the intention you paired it with the feeling and how you actually managed your mental health yes mental alertness as we came together in the beginning already we have to learn mentally to have a conscious control over our own brain processes we have to learn that but that's exactly what I did and I did it so many times before in nature now I had to do it here so through the contemplation I saw it I felt the connection yes I can do it I felt an immediate relief of all the anxiety what do we have to do what it is what is that you know all these thoughts creating anxiety and all that was boom gone and I drank coffee I listen to nice music with my daughter there we were we are happy terms I went full confident to the University into the brain scan and it began and then after the accession the doctors the professor's were truly flabbergasted because they never had seen the results coming out I mean you remember the cognitive results in the
remember the cognitive results in the school they were not good yeah this was fabulous all right so now when I wanted I want you to explain that in a minute but I just want to cookie circle back before you explain the impact what they saw it from the fMRI in the brain is you pretty much mastered the art of being uncomfortable if I hear throughout everything that you are teaching being cold as uncomfortable being in a stress situation is uncomfortable and what you are saying is if we master the art by being consciously aware and realizing that this changes our body then this is when those shifts will happen and that's a conscious learned decision to master the art of being comfortable is that correct yes absolutely if you learn to let go of thoughts which is their neocortex and this comfort zone behavior the conscious control and with your insula and being relaxed and this and there you want to keep their homeostasis and that's who you are that's and it goes up you don't know I want to go back you shelter or you put on the air-conditioning or you go with the car to a place whatever all these things they have gone so far that we are in the confines of our thoughts but we haven't learned how to get out of these thought processes because we are to condition there and it's too strong so what I have done is going into the
so what I have done is going into the cold and go into the cold it's consciously going into a very uncomfortable situation and my body knows that and my brain knows it and still I do it because I got a hunch there is more than meets the eye there's more than that what we have learned in in schools I want to find it but I have to break through this conditions these condition patterns and that's what I did through going into the cold does is not a pleasant feeling or so but you learn how to get into it the deepest part of your brain you learn to get past your thinking brain your conditioning you get into areas of the brain and you learn to have neurological pathway connection which makes you able to ignite it or activate it when unpleasantness is going on and you can do that through intention of course you can do that through intention so you if I have to sorry I didn't mean to interrupt you there I'm just thinking listening so carefully to what you're saying and I know a bit of your story because you've gone through like your wife was better with depression and committed suicide eight stories down it is a beautiful woman who has four children with me and she was into manic depression depression into manic depression psychosis in the schizophrenia she had about seven
schizophrenia she had about seven personalities according to the psychiatrist's and then they gave her these injections and medicines a tea tree and had only worse and worse that result she kissed the children goodbye we for jumping down that is Tara Tara in the mind sheer terror so then my heart was broken yeah my was fully broken and still no it has let it's almost a sacrifice of Destiny I had to meet this woman and whatever happened it's destiny but there are times I was heartbroken my dream was kept it was all gone and to be there with little money with four children so how deep can you go you got to survive because you got the children you gotta be energetic you gotta be able to create a new nest and the nest warmth love and care and the safety you got it that's all psychically I gotta be strong there is no other way you know and my children make me survive and the cold now comes in the cold learnt through the court going into court every day it was the only way to steal my mind Wow to get these thought processes of a broken heart of this agony of missing it got me out of there instilled my mind and that saved me and
instilled my mind and that saved me and now I am teaching this to the psychiatry of the world that we have found ways that is able to bring people back into a sense of control while of having or depression manic depression psychosis bipolar schizophrenia or whatever mental disorder those people have lost a sense of control within their own brain and for dose I tell you doctors listening Hey prove me wrong guys but I have found a way to give those people a sense of control a direct sense of control back and that is through default adaptation gradual cold adaptation and breathing exercises so from what I'm understanding was I I'm totally agree in the agreement which is an entity calling bipolar and all these names calling him a disease saying like it's an it that's controlled you we could use our minds to change this yes we can't deny that these things are very real but we have to realize that this doesn't control us but people that are in those very deep states very real real states because of what Evers happened whatever tome or whatever's going on in their life is always a cause this always a story just to tell them just to medicate them is not the answer we have to show them how to get their mind back again and so if I'm hearing you saying is that you're getting in the cold and doing the breathing of very practical real physical things that you could do that increase the resilience of the body and the brain and when your
the body and the brain and when your brain and your body are in that very high resilient state that's when you could start dealing with stuff like carrying on being a parent or four children with dealing with the pain that they've gone through with it mom they're having committed suicide etcetera etc you triggered your body to get it strong but Inlet enabled you to see how strong your mind was in order to cope have I summarized that correctly yeah it's not only a resilience it is actually the natural state of our should be like meditation we should not be like twice a day fully in peace with ourselves all day yes yes our natural state should be meditated I Kiwis peace wonder is peace action winter is action it is physics when you go in a hundred percent action it's peace I totally agree with you there's that piece that you're talking about that's something that I constantly talk about as well we can't just made it safe for 10 minutes and then fall apart the rest of the day and then love for the next meditation then you can't just sort of think that go to your therapist once a week but they're worried you do the other six days of the week you have to be able to control your mind 24 / 7 so the techniques that I've developed are teaching people how to do that and what you've developed is teaching people how to kick-start that and really maintain that I mean it's just absolutely fantastic as we said in the beginning we we have to do some work together because this is outstanding what you've achieved and we have so many people that do this there's a lot of doctors a lot of physicians a lot of people in mental health that are listening to this podcast now and learning huge amounts
podcast now and learning huge amounts from this and I'm just so excited but let's quickly look at the impact from the fMRI study that was done and how they saw that your brain was a super brain like you had turned into this unbelievably brilliant superhuman that we all are exactly so as normal human beings we should feel super super is more than normal that is the optimized well-being should be within our control and we have shown that we actually massively are not tapping into the full potentials to be able to tackle mood and disease or information and mental disorders if we only look at these two then already what do we need to tap into these seemingly unsolvable matters within the contemporary medical understanding the depressions and inflammation only buy pills and therapies and or whatever therapies etc I say we as people we are able through cold showering gradual called adaptation to optimize the cardiovascular system which provides directly a lot more energy and it makes our veins and arteries very flexible and and their heart rate goes down 20-30 times a minutes 24 hours a day that's like meditation that's incredible
that's like meditation that's incredible because you also referred to exactly that does that but we've got to do that all day long and and what I love how you say one that you correctly reference the fact that inflammation is a major underlying cause of disease and the dis breathing and this cold adapt a shindig increa uncomfortable is a way of reducing the inflammation absolutely information is directly related to biological stress and that D regulates the immune system causing information because we breathe shallow we have a constant presence of acidity in our lymphatic system and the lymphatic system it's like a garbage system it's fluid and car in the end it chronically when it gets there chronically most of the people it is so it gets back into the system and creates deregulation through inflammation these coupling proteins etc that is because of the low acidity coming back in the end into our system on a chronic basis and for that we got these breathing techniques to purify just within 20 minutes we have shown in the university to spike the alkalinity within our blood and reset the body to bring about epinephrine and that resets the body like being in a very dangerous moment adrenaline or epinephrine comes in shoot and reset
epinephrine comes in shoot and reset your body to the utmost functionality that we we have lost this ability because we never seek those dangerous so-called moments but we can create it mimic it through these breathing techniques that's incredible that people can actually mimic that sorry to interrupt you but this is our only people can hear the profoundness of what you've just said you can actually mimic that state where your body will actually release the epinephrine and reset itself so that you can actually be stronger in your mind literally absolutely I mean your body becomes a vessel you can use through your mind that is the logic our mind is the cockpit and we should be and in control over the buttons but if the electrical systems do not work well because the biochemistry is not right because there's blockages and fears and inhibitions going on then it doesn't work and you don't learn how to push the buttons anymore because you know it doesn't work so we have never learned how to purify the body to make it a vessel we can use through our mind now listen to this they have done a comparison between our study wherein we activated the adrenaline to an amount comparing it to another study where they study people going for the first time into a bungee jump so the amount of brenell and going when you for the first
brenell and going when you for the first time go into a bunker jump was as much as the one we did with breathing exercises lying in that receiving the ejection with the e. coli bacteria so the e. coli bacteria had no chance against that shot of adrenaline are caused by these breathing techniques you see that shows that we are in control over virus and bacteria or inflammation anytime we only have to learn to breathe deeply I manipulate I will biochemistry reset it I mean we good and then we couple that with the mind so it's a three pillars think people need to remember that it's the three pillar of the the breathing and the uncomfortableness of the cold and then also the mind sitting and getting in touch with your feelings then please talk about I'm so excited about the if MRI results talk a little bit about that for me what they saw in your brain when you did that in Chicago normal people 74 people before me we're doing the same and a all showed highly activated the prefrontal cortex right yes and then the insula very low well being exposed to cold water this is logical when warm comes on the insula begins to work again and the prefrontal cortex begins to go lower but they did
cortex begins to go lower but they did not see something else relevant robustly activated and then in my case they saw the prefrontal cortex very little activated while being exposed to cold water the insula was not really at work but what was really at work because I just felt okay was the hairy aqueduct all green hemisphere which is the deepest part of our brain the most primitive part of the brain stem it is the lizard brain the reptilian brain the crocodile brain the the brain standard the reactive brain I made that work through the intention and then they saw the results of the skin temperature rose with one degree and it stayed over there while being exposed to ice water and then for several minutes then going away again warm water seven minutes cold water again no difference in skin temperature I had risen before through the power of intense and their skin temperature with one degree and it stayed over there that's them mind over matter and it is not only about cold Caroline it's about learning through the mind how to deal with stress
through the mind how to deal with stress and stress a coldest one stress heat can be a stressor bacteria virus can be a stressor emotions can be a stress mental stress pressure stress etc so we have their innate capacity to mentally tackle by the power of intention stress that will come in the future to us yes to connect it's it's so brilliant you know this research the clinical trial that I'm actually just be finished in the same in January and I'm busy now with my team with me analyzing and what we seeing is you know I'm hearing you say this and I have to control myself because I'm getting very excited because thirty eight years ago developed a theory or nearly thirty five years ago developed a theory on the non conscious mind which is deeper than the subconscious which is the consciousness when you awake the non conscious is awake 24 / 7 the conscious Minds own your work when you're awake so the non conscious mind is as powerful innate intelligent driving force of who we are where the power resides and I've always speculated and I was challenged in all the years by a lot of the professors a lot of scientists and I've been working for 38 years to show this that when you tap into that non conscious mind you're going to change the way that you function and it's through deep intentional thinking and it's through a constructive process of learning how to do it and throw at my mercy clinical now here you say all this and you saying the same thing in a different way just with different techniques and I see if we use cue EEG we didn't use if they are I but we use key cue EEG and we
they are I but we use key cue EEG and we also the blood measures cortisol ACTH various we also looked at the telomeres I know you've done some work some of the scientists have done some work at the DNA and the telomeres with you as well and what we're seeing is those people that really intentionally do what you've just described when they're really intentionally tap into the depth of the non conscious mind when you activate that the Phe this deepest part of your brain when you tap into those parts of your brain that is when we see the shift happening and there's the response in the brain and the response in people's lives is phenomenal so I mean I agree I back up every single thing that you saying and you backing up what I'm saying literally it's absolutely fantastic and and I just want to thank you for pushing through and pursuing what you have and in the way that you have done wow that is like music to my ears yes we are listening to a very great classical phenomenal divin etudes music coming in and we want to translate it so everybody is able to hear exactly so yes here's my suggestion I want to continue a party maybe in part two we have to go in more into have you think also about a possible study we can do to show that we are able to tap into consciously into the deepest of our brain and to go past our conditioning how does the immune system relate be specific the activation in which is
specific the activation in which is needed of activation of immune system consciously done how does it look like in the inside of the brain I think it is directly related to the endocannabinoid system and hypothalamus pituitary glands adrenal glands and all but we have to show it in brain scans because people they don't realize that we actually in 2013 have fundamentally changed a medical science and the perspectives of medical science by showing that we are able to tap into the autonomous nervous system deeply anytime by anybody very accessible and very effective and it's done by the minds and the breathing but in the end it should be part of our controlled system of daily life I totally agree with you totally get it with you and what I love about your work is that you are actually facilitating this process group sometimes mind work even though we're always using our mind it's sometimes really hard when you stuck in that hamster wheel cycle of toxicity and toxic thinking it's hard to kind of break that cycle so the exercise the way you teach breathing and the end the immersion in the cold or fantastic physical ways very powerful that shift your ability to start using your mind in more effective way so it's good you're using the physical to enhance the mental but you're using the mental to enhance the physical and it all works together which is so powerful what I think is so
which is so powerful what I think is so very important is is using technology like cue EEG which is what we use in in our studies along with fMRI not only do you just see the structural change but you see activation real-time so for example I could even predict in your brain if we had to actually scan your brain using a cue EEG we would see tremendous amounts of gamma activity which is a wave that flows from the front to the back of the brain an energy wave your brain is generating energy so the Q EEG is picking up the energy where is it fMRI is looking at the blood flow and also energy in a different way so it's two different ways of looking at the activity of the brain so that firing that they saw the way the prefrontal cortex dropped down in activity and calmed down we would probably see a pattern of increased alpha in that part of the brain which means that your brain is calm so that you can learn and you can get into the depths of your brain so we would see high levels of gamma which shows that you're learning and integrating and you would see high levels of what we call the sailor wave and Delta wave which means that you're tapping into the deepest part of you and this is what I saw in my studies currently in my clinical trials those people that really set their intention we're determined to get in touch with their feelings just like you said they were showing those kind of patterns the others that were just letting their minds just run like a mock and just kind of almost not embrace the discount but just kind of run with it instead of embracing and stopping and managing their brains went into I mean they were went crazy actually called it a coronavirus brain just for the ones of describing the brain but there was just this high bay like everything instead of
this high bay like everything instead of the gamma activity flowing like a wave on a beach wave builds and then crashes and bulls and crashes that's good what was happening it was flowing like a waterfall which was just as pounding activity and then you can't think straight either and through mind management you can change and you can shift that and that's what you're talking about I mean you use your your scientific research studies are doing it with all the the blood assay is looking at your immune system looking at the fMRI I mean this is real what what we are saying here for the listeners is what women are saying here is that we have incredible power in our minds incredible ability that doesn't mean life is going to be a walk in the park as you've heard when went through a lot of stuff I've gone through a lot of stuff all of us have a story we're not saying that it's going to be a walk in the park and suddenly life is full of roses and absolutely not it life is going to be tough still because events and things happen but your ability to manage through them that is what we're talking about that can change when would you like to add to that absolutely you're going to be able to stay in the eye of the hurricane of the tornado and there is the peace while everything is going on life will continue and all its beauty and all its aggression always a rationality but you are just watching it and then suddenly you get power over it I just want to show a threshold of the power of our mind being able to get within our control hmm and what you do with it you better treat life with love
with it you better treat life with love and advance that what does what what our soul is that I leave up to you this is a non dogmatic inside and technique that will lead up to your control of your own mind that that's what we want to give to the people and for those who have mal-intent they very soon will learn that happiness is related to love and care and there it is and then you are and you are okay you don't need to accumulate somebody else's property or expand your terrain or make more money and all those things is much related to the mind and in tactics a titre love is the deeper part of the brain and I like to be there I totally agree with you I love that love is the deeper part of the brain it's and the quantum physicists are talking about this now as well I had a very interesting conversation with someone who's working in that arena as well and talking about how we actually on a quantum level we can pick up these waves of energy and they love waves the deepest part of us is love you know so what you're saying is you tapping into you your methods are tapping into that resource of the love within us if I may I want to ask you could you I know you started doing some work and we're gonna definitely do a part two but I want to slip in two quick questions and I don't know how quickly you can answer them even if we start them now kanta cup at another time but how much of your ability do you think is based on your training and how much on your DNA it's very simple I got an identical twin so he's not able to do what I do because
so he's not able to do what I do because I trained it like the beginning of our conversation you can have the same type of DNA going on in the brain and the capacities and the neurology but if you don't train it you stay beyond that is absolutely brilliant I'm so pleased you said that their answer because for years I've been teaching a concept called the effector you you and I both know there's been the debate over nature-nurture for years and it's been a kind of a ridiculous debate because obviously it's nature plus nurture but there's a thing driving it and that is you your effector I call it the effector or mind our choice and that's exactly what you've just said now you've chosen to use your mind and to train your mind to train your body now is your twin has he learned how to use this method was one of your brother's is able to do this now to a certain extent is that correct yes I taught him all what I know but I have been some longer time within this all I've learned a lot of literature I met a lot of professors a lot of doctors and you know I did my schooling yes you've done your schooling you've done your homework so he's your twin brother doing this method now absolutely and he enjoys it very much now and yeah they love it and your other siblings as well they do that's incredible well well I'm so enthralled by a conversation and I'm so excited that we're gonna do a part two and probably a part three and part four and I would just want to thank you for how happy yes and a study do you research that's probably the most important thing and you're not going to jump on a separate call and start
jump on a separate call and start planning that because that is essential and I want to thank you for your hard work for how you've taken tragedy in your life and you've turned that into something that can shift the world and you know your objective is to get us in touch with our inner nature which is love and to use that power in a constructive and healthy way which is what it means to be human in the first place so I just want to thank you for what you're doing and I want to thank you for taking the time for me with me today it's been an incredible discussion fascinating and wonderful it is and you have to thank yourself too because all the words also addressing yourself so I thank you all so very much and I see a very fertile new soil coming up with so many possible ideas flourishing coming out shooting up I see it at springtime I love that a springtime well thank you so much I hope you found today's podcast interesting and helpful if you want more tips and help with managing anxiety depression and mental health be sure to visit my website at dr. Leif comm and you sign up for my weekly newsletter where I also include a schedule of my speaking events and so much more and follow me on social media I'm on Twitter Facebook and Instagram just look for dr. Caroline leaf also I love seeing all your posts on social media about this podcast I love seeing what resonates with you and
love seeing what resonates with you and what you've learned so be sure to continue posting and tagging me and letting me know what you think and how these tips worked out for you and don't forget leave a review and keep spreading the word about this podcast thank you for joining me today I really hope you learn something new and helpful till then I'm dr. Caroline leaf this podcast represents the opinions of myself and my guests the content here should not be taken as medical advice the content here is for educational and informational purposes only please consult your healthcare professional for any individual medical questions you may have well we make every effort to ensure that the information we are sharing is accurate we welcome any comments suggestions or Corrections of errors this
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Podcast 151: Interview with the "Iceman" Wim Hof on How to Train Your Mind to Overcome Any Challenge offers a useful lens on how modern recovery is changing: less performance theatre, more deliberate practice. The details vary, but the principle is steady. The body adapts when the signal is clear and the dose is respectful.
76 minute conversation 3 core levers: breath, temperature, attention 1 repeatable practice: return to equilibrium
Breathing is automatic, but it is also accessible. That makes it a rare bridge between conscious attention and the nervous system. A slower, fuller breath can shift the body away from alarm and toward control.
Cold water reveals the stress response without disguise. The first reaction is often sharp: a gasp, a tightened chest, a quick urge to escape. The practice begins when awareness stays present inside that reaction.
The most useful protocols are repeatable. Short, deliberate exposure builds trust. The body learns that intensity can be met, held, and released.
Mental clarity is not only a thought exercise. It is often the result of physiology changing state. Breath, temperature, and attention give the mind a steadier foundation.
The pause is part of the performance. A measured stressor only serves you when recovery is built into the design.
Keep the first dose modest enough that your breath remains controlled.
Pair intensity with recovery. Heat, cold, and stillness all have a role.
Track how you feel afterward, not only what you endured during the session.
