Cold Exposure, Resilience, and the Biology of Pair-Bonding: A Conversation with Dr. Thomas Seager
Dr. Thomas Seager on how cold reshapes metabolism, restores hormonal function, and — shared with a partner — deepens the bonds that sustain long relationships.
Video·degrees of health·12 min read·June 2026
Dr. Thomas Seager on why the body expects cold, how it reshapes metabolism and hormones, and what happens when you share the ice with someone you love.
Cold Is Not Optional — It's What the Body Expects
Your body is not merely adapted to cold — it expects it. In the same way movement is built into our biology as a requirement, cold exposure is a physiological expectation encoded through millennia of living outdoors, uninsulated, without climate control. When that expectation goes unmet, the body moves toward disease and decay — not dramatically, not immediately, but quietly, the way all slow decline unfolds.
The underlying principle is hormesis — the biological truth that controlled stressors make us stronger. Variability is not the enemy; it is the mechanism by which resilience is built. Intermittent fasting operates on the same principle: withdraw a comfort the body expects indefinitely, and a cascade of repair begins. Dr. Thomas Seager arrived at cold through this same logic, drawn by the science of hormesis and convinced that deliberate discomfort was the path back to metabolic health and sustained vitality.
The entry point, for Seager, was humble: a book recommendation. The author Mike Cernovich, before pursuing other directions, wrote a self-improvement book that contained one simple directive — take cold showers. Seager, a scientist not prone to credulous acceptance, decided to try it anyway. He has not stopped since. What began as a skeptic's experiment became a protocol that restructured how he understood his own physiology.
Not all cold exposure produces the same response. Research from Finnish scientists working near the Arctic Circle drew a clear distinction between partial-body and whole-body immersion. Partial immersion — torso above the waterline, limbs submerged — up-regulates the central nervous system, raises heart rate, and sharpens sympathetic activation, producing the alertness and mental clarity associated with readiness. Whole-body immersion tells a different story: once fully submerged, the parasympathetic response takes over, and a quality of deep, grounded calm settles in. The body has two distinct modes of responding to cold; both are valuable, and they are not interchangeable.
Modern life offers comforts our ancestors never experienced. We desire them — warmth, seamless temperature control, shelter from every season — because our brains evolved to pursue exactly these things. But desire and physiological optimization are not the same thing. The body is evolutionarily prepared for cold in the same way it is prepared for exercise and sunlight; deny it what it expects, and you do not achieve comfort — you accumulate deficit.
The science of hormesis reframes discomfort as signal. The gasp, the tightening skin, the involuntary quickening of breath when you enter cold water — this is not the body in crisis; it is the body activating. Each controlled exposure prompts adaptation; each adaptation expands what feels tolerable and builds the resilience required to meet life's demands without strain. This is not a philosophy of endurance for its own sake. It is a precise understanding of how the physiology responds to demand.
Consider how much of modern wellness is simply a return to what evolution already specified: movement, sunlight, temperature variability. Cold is the ambient condition humans inhabited for hundreds of thousands of years. Seager's conclusion is direct: we do not get sick because of cold — we get sick from its absence. The comforts we have engineered are not the problem; the assumption that comfort and health are equivalent is.
your body is your body is your body is evolutionarily expecting you to exercise evolutionarily expecting you to exercise evolutionarily expecting you to exercise and you might not like it and so if you and you might not like it and so if you and you might not like it and so if you don't do it your body goes into a state don't do it your body goes into a state don't do it your body goes into a state of disease or decay in the same way that of disease or decay in the same way that of disease or decay in the same way that your body expects sunshine and exercise your body expects sunshine and exercise your body expects sunshine and exercise and healthy foods your body is and healthy foods your body is and healthy foods your body is evolutionarily adapted to expect evolutionarily adapted to expect evolutionarily adapted to expect deliberate cold exposure you got to give deliberate cold exposure you got to give deliberate cold exposure you got to give it to your body in order to maintain the it to your body in order to maintain the it to your body in order to maintain the
this morning and I just emerged from this morning and I just emerged from like the you know the black hole of like the you know the black hole of like the you know the black hole of inbox and I was like oh wait a second inbox and I was like oh wait a second inbox and I was like oh wait a second I'm supposed to talk to Ben right now I'm supposed to talk to Ben right now I'm supposed to talk to Ben right now you're in the UK I'm just waking up and you're in the UK I'm just waking up and you're in the UK I'm just waking up and thank goodness that you know this is thank goodness that you know this is thank goodness that you know this is over Riverside so I can put on a halfway over Riverside so I can put on a halfway over Riverside so I can put on a halfway decent shirt look like a scientist and decent shirt look like a scientist and decent shirt look like a scientist and no one needs to know that I'm still in no one needs to know that I'm still in no one needs to know that I'm still in my pajama bottoms well it takes one no my pajama bottoms well it takes one no my pajama bottoms well it takes one no one me too all good it's the top half of
variability can make us stronger and so variability can make us stronger and so I'd worked some intermittent fasting I'd worked some intermittent fasting I'd worked some intermittent fasting into my diet and I'd lost a lot of into my diet and I'd lost a lot of into my diet and I'd lost a lot of weight but this's one book that I read weight but this's one book that I read weight but this's one book that I read uh before Mike cernovich became a uh before Mike cernovich became a uh before Mike cernovich became a controversial political journalist controversial political journalist controversial political journalist journalist and a little bit of an idiot journalist and a little bit of an idiot journalist and a little bit of an idiot he wrote a book called gorilla mindset he wrote a book called gorilla mindset he wrote a book called gorilla mindset and in this book he said you should take and in this book he said you should take and in this book he said you should take cold showers so I'm like okay you know cold showers so I'm like okay you know cold showers so I'm like okay you know I'm going to try anything I have a rule
about whole body cold water imer about whole body cold water imer than the fins at the University of U or than the fins at the University of U or than the fins at the University of U or I can't even say it right you know but I can't even say it right you know but I can't even say it right you know but they're up at the Arctic Circle and they they're up at the Arctic Circle and they they're up at the Arctic Circle and they have the best scientists on cold water have the best scientists on cold water have the best scientists on cold water therapy and they compared partial body therapy and they compared partial body therapy and they compared partial body to whole body cold water immersion to whole body cold water immersion to whole body cold water immersion partial body UPS your heart rate it partial body UPS your heart rate it partial body UPS your heart rate it stimulates the central nervous system so stimulates the central nervous system so stimulates the central nervous system so everything up regulates but whole body everything up regulates but whole body everything up regulates but whole body down regulates once you get in you
that's a really good segue because how that's a really good segue because how many people have actually the discomfort many people have actually the discomfort many people have actually the discomfort that our ancestors had in their everyday that our ancestors had in their everyday that our ancestors had in their everyday life maybe your your friend who does the life maybe your your friend who does the life maybe your your friend who does the windows does yourself you do with your windows does yourself you do with your windows does yourself you do with your sort of voluntary ice exposure but or sort of voluntary ice exposure but or sort of voluntary ice exposure but or cold exposure to say but how important cold exposure to say but how important cold exposure to say but how important is fostering some discomfort into the is fostering some discomfort into the is fostering some discomfort into the human existence great question um I human existence great question um I human existence great question um I think about my grandfather sometimes you think about my grandfather sometimes you think about my grandfather sometimes you might have WR uh read some of the
pre-prepared meals that they never had doesn't mean that our bodies respond doesn't mean that our bodies respond doesn't mean that our bodies respond well to the Comforts that we're sort of well to the Comforts that we're sort of well to the Comforts that we're sort of wired to wired to wired to desire we expect cold exposure that is desire we expect cold exposure that is desire we expect cold exposure that is our bodies are evolutionarily adapted to our bodies are evolutionarily adapted to our bodies are evolutionarily adapted to the cold in a way where we don't get it the cold in a way where we don't get it the cold in a way where we don't get it then we get sick it's very much like then we get sick it's very much like then we get sick it's very much like exercise your body is exercise your body is exercise your body is evolutionarily expecting you to exercise evolutionarily expecting you to exercise evolutionarily expecting you to exercise and you might not like it and so if you and you might not like it and so if you
without brown fat you typically become without brown fat you typically become metabolically metabolically metabolically disregulated insulin resistance type 2 disregulated insulin resistance type 2 disregulated insulin resistance type 2 diabetes Alzheimers these are all slow diabetes Alzheimers these are all slow diabetes Alzheimers these are all slow moving but eventual consequences of moving but eventual consequences of moving but eventual consequences of failing to get cold failing to activate failing to get cold failing to activate failing to get cold failing to activate your brown fat of allowing your your brown fat of allowing your your brown fat of allowing your metabolism to metabolism to metabolism to disregulated how do you know when you've disregulated how do you know when you've disregulated how do you know when you've activate you're activating Brown fat and activate you're activating Brown fat and activate you're activating Brown fat and is is there a conversion of can you
no longer applies in the same way you no longer applies in the same way you might you know for me it's about six or might you know for me it's about six or might you know for me it's about six or seven degrees C so maybe 40 degrees seven degrees C so maybe 40 degrees seven degrees C so maybe 40 degrees Fahrenheit in uh the us anything above Fahrenheit in uh the us anything above Fahrenheit in uh the us anything above that is like bathwater it's just boring that is like bathwater it's just boring that is like bathwater it's just boring I don't get the same kind of you know I don't get the same kind of you know I don't get the same kind of you know activation because my body is acclimated activation because my body is acclimated activation because my body is acclimated in several ways that allows me to stay in several ways that allows me to stay in several ways that allows me to stay comfortable in the cold once you become comfortable in the cold once you become comfortable in the cold once you become acclimated you don't need to go long acclimated you don't need to go long acclimated you don't need to go long enough to shiver you might but just your
and was held in ranomi in December so and was held in ranomi in December so only sort of the bravest of scientists only sort of the bravest of scientists only sort of the bravest of scientists are going to go fly to Helsinki then I are going to go fly to Helsinki then I are going to go fly to Helsinki then I get one of those little planes it takes get one of those little planes it takes get one of those little planes it takes me up to Roan neami it's the closest me up to Roan neami it's the closest me up to Roan neami it's the closest I've ever been to the Arctic Circle I've ever been to the Arctic Circle I've ever been to the Arctic Circle they've got all the displays in the they've got all the displays in the they've got all the displays in the airport about Santa's Workshop just to airport about Santa's Workshop just to airport about Santa's Workshop just to remind you how close you are to the remind you how close you are to the remind you how close you are to the North Pole and I'm checking into the North Pole and I'm checking into the North Pole and I'm checking into the hotel and all I have is a scarf a
into heat and it's the mitochondria that into heat and it's the mitochondria that do that so white fat cells with their do that so white fat cells with their do that so white fat cells with their principal purpose is to store energy and principal purpose is to store energy and principal purpose is to store energy and they don't have a lot of mitochondria at they don't have a lot of mitochondria at they don't have a lot of mitochondria at all but Brown fat have thousands of all but Brown fat have thousands of all but Brown fat have thousands of mitochondria and each mitochondria mitochondria and each mitochondria mitochondria and each mitochondria organel contains multiple copies of its organel contains multiple copies of its organel contains multiple copies of its own DNA and this is something that you own DNA and this is something that you own DNA and this is something that you know they never taught me in high school know they never taught me in high school know they never taught me in high school microbiology or whatever the heck I took microbiology or whatever the heck I took microbiology or whatever the heck I took you know back in the early 80s they
they go up that is Alzheimer's is one uh they go up that is Alzheimer's is one uh heart disease is another um these are heart disease is another um these are heart disease is another um these are diseases that are related or associated diseases that are related or associated diseases that are related or associated with metabolic with metabolic with metabolic disregulation fixing your mitochondria disregulation fixing your mitochondria disregulation fixing your mitochondria will help fix the or reduce the risk of will help fix the or reduce the risk of will help fix the or reduce the risk of these a so-called age related diseases these a so-called age related diseases these a so-called age related diseases so you get into the cold water therapy so you get into the cold water therapy so you get into the cold water therapy you stimulate your mitobiogenesis and you stimulate your mitobiogenesis and you stimulate your mitobiogenesis and it's like aging yourself in Reverse at it's like aging yourself in Reverse at it's like aging yourself in Reverse at least biologically speaking the
fertility is a great thing to optimize fertility is a great thing to optimize for how can um cold exposure and um how for how can um cold exposure and um how for how can um cold exposure and um how can cold exposure affect the male can cold exposure affect the male can cold exposure affect the male endocrine system I think uh is is the endocrine system I think uh is is the endocrine system I think uh is is the tangent I'd love you to go down if it's tangent I'd love you to go down if it's tangent I'd love you to go down if it's okay let's talk about men first then um okay let's talk about men first then um okay let's talk about men first then um for me this was an accident um I mean for me this was an accident um I mean for me this was an accident um I mean take let me take you back to I'm in my take let me take you back to I'm in my take let me take you back to I'm in my early 50s I've lost a lot of weight I early 50s I've lost a lot of weight I early 50s I've lost a lot of weight I used to be 250 pounds I don't even know used to be 250 pounds I don't even know used to be 250 pounds I don't even know how many Stone is or you know whatever
the allopathic Medical Institution would the allopathic Medical Institution would create a Cascade of diagnosis that would create a Cascade of diagnosis that would create a Cascade of diagnosis that would result in overtreatment I said I'm not result in overtreatment I said I'm not result in overtreatment I said I'm not doing it I'm going to talk to other men doing it I'm going to talk to other men doing it I'm going to talk to other men first and the stories they told of first and the stories they told of first and the stories they told of biopsies gone bad biopsies that led to biopsies gone bad biopsies that led to biopsies gone bad biopsies that led to sepsis infections of of prostate sepsis infections of of prostate sepsis infections of of prostate ectomies that resulted in incontinence ectomies that resulted in incontinence ectomies that resulted in incontinence and erectile dysfunction they scared the and erectile dysfunction they scared the and erectile dysfunction they scared the crap out of me I was determined to do crap out of me I was determined to do crap out of me I was determined to do whatever I could to reduce my prostate
bike for like 20 minutes and then did bike for like 20 minutes and then did some cold water stimulation testosterone some cold water stimulation testosterone some cold water stimulation testosterone went down lutenizing hormone went down went down lutenizing hormone went down went down lutenizing hormone went down and then for some reason that they don't and then for some reason that they don't and then for some reason that they don't really explain they reversed it they really explain they reversed it they really explain they reversed it they said okay we're going to do the cold said okay we're going to do the cold said okay we're going to do the cold water stem first and then we're going to water stem first and then we're going to water stem first and then we're going to do the exercise testosterone went up do the exercise testosterone went up do the exercise testosterone went up luteinizing hormone went up it's luteinizing hormone went up it's luteinizing hormone went up it's luteinizing hormone that signals the luteinizing hormone that signals the luteinizing hormone that signals the gonads to produce the testosterone so
then for years no one read my stuff I then for years no one read my stuff I you know I'm just putting it up at you know I'm just putting it up at you know I'm just putting it up at morasco forge.com and there's like 300 morasco forge.com and there's like 300 morasco forge.com and there's like 300 people who read it until December people who read it until December people who read it until December 2022 when Joe Rogan had David Goggins on 2022 when Joe Rogan had David Goggins on 2022 when Joe Rogan had David Goggins on and David Goggins used to be a Navy SEAL and David Goggins used to be a Navy SEAL and David Goggins used to be a Navy SEAL and they tra in the Pacific Ocean out of and they tra in the Pacific Ocean out of and they tra in the Pacific Ocean out of Coronada Island and they know a lot Coronada Island and they know a lot Coronada Island and they know a lot about cold water and Rogan said well about cold water and Rogan said well about cold water and Rogan said well there's this guy and he goes to my there's this guy and he goes to my there's this guy and he goes to my Instagram and he puts that up on the
the UK 300 n per deciliter is low the UK 300 n per deciliter is low upwards of maybe 800 is high but I mean upwards of maybe 800 is high but I mean upwards of maybe 800 is high but I mean I've heard you say before that the I've heard you say before that the I've heard you say before that the reference you disagree with the reference you disagree with the reference you disagree with the reference range is it my correct say reference range is it my correct say reference range is it my correct say yeah um you know my lab reports come yeah um you know my lab reports come yeah um you know my lab reports come back now and they say I'm back now and they say I'm back now and they say I'm abnormal well I don't want to be normal abnormal well I don't want to be normal abnormal well I don't want to be normal Ben I want to be better than normal Ben I want to be better than normal Ben I want to be better than normal because the reference range is C cated because the reference range is C cated because the reference range is C cated to the results that they're getting from
it to some friends like you're taking it to some friends like you're taking something I like well no look at my something I like well no look at my something I like well no look at my lutenizing hormone my lutenizing hormone lutenizing hormone my lutenizing hormone lutenizing hormone my lutenizing hormone is through the roof and for the listener is through the roof and for the listener is through the roof and for the listener if you were to take something exogenous if you were to take something exogenous if you were to take something exogenous something like trt or steroids or something like trt or steroids or something like trt or steroids or something like this your lutenizing something like this your lutenizing something like this your lutenizing hormone would drop down to basically hormone would drop down to basically hormone would drop down to basically zero um so it's it's a remarkably easy zero um so it's it's a remarkably easy zero um so it's it's a remarkably easy protocol for The Listener how much protocol for The Listener how much protocol for The Listener how much exerise need is is a walk enough do they
if you're going a little warmer maybe um if you're going a little warmer maybe um maybe the rule of thumb changes the maybe the rule of thumb changes the maybe the rule of thumb changes the point that I'm trying to emphasize is a point that I'm trying to emphasize is a point that I'm trying to emphasize is a brisk walk jumping rope kettle bells it brisk walk jumping rope kettle bells it brisk walk jumping rope kettle bells it doesn't take a lot of exercise some men doesn't take a lot of exercise some men doesn't take a lot of exercise some men will say well I don't want to do my will say well I don't want to do my will say well I don't want to do my weights after my cold I'm afraid that my weights after my cold I'm afraid that my weights after my cold I'm afraid that my muscles will be so tight that um I'll muscles will be so tight that um I'll muscles will be so tight that um I'll injure myself I don't have any reports injure myself I don't have any reports injure myself I don't have any reports of this but it sounds like it's a of this but it sounds like it's a of this but it sounds like it's a worthwhile risk to be careful about go
can't prove but if you have a daunting can't prove but if you have a daunting to-do list and you conquer that daunting to-do list and you conquer that daunting to-do list and you conquer that daunting to-do list if you look at it and scares to-do list if you look at it and scares to-do list if you look at it and scares you a little bit and you conquer it I'm you a little bit and you conquer it I'm you a little bit and you conquer it I'm convinced that there's a psychological convinced that there's a psychological convinced that there's a psychological testosterone benefit and boost to it testosterone benefit and boost to it testosterone benefit and boost to it there's a nice line I like from Joseph there's a nice line I like from Joseph there's a nice line I like from Joseph Campbell says the cave you fear to ends Campbell says the cave you fear to ends Campbell says the cave you fear to ends to holds the treasure you seek and every to holds the treasure you seek and every to holds the treasure you seek and every time I look at the Ice Bar and every time I look at the Ice Bar and every time I look at the Ice Bar and every time I don't want to go in there the
the benefits of the cold water therapy the benefits of the cold water therapy what is the what have you learned from what is the what have you learned from what is the what have you learned from the cold I mean I think when you when the cold I mean I think when you when the cold I mean I think when you when you're in the cold for that long and at you're in the cold for that long and at you're in the cold for that long and at such extreme temperatures it's really such extreme temperatures it's really such extreme temperatures it's really hard to not know not be confronted with hard to not know not be confronted with hard to not know not be confronted with your true self here's what I've learned your true self here's what I've learned your true self here's what I've learned my fears are [ __ ] all the things my fears are [ __ ] all the things my fears are [ __ ] all the things that I'm afraid of that uh I think I that I'm afraid of that uh I think I that I'm afraid of that uh I think I can't do all the catastrophes that are can't do all the catastrophes that are can't do all the catastrophes that are rattling around in my mind all the
equivalent of what I just learned in the equivalent of what I just learned in the ice bath elanar Roosevelt said I know ice bath elanar Roosevelt said I know ice bath elanar Roosevelt said I know elanar Roosevelt I'm going in a elanar Roosevelt I'm going in a elanar Roosevelt I'm going in a different direction here you know she different direction here you know she different direction here you know she wasn't known for her Fitness advice and wasn't known for her Fitness advice and wasn't known for her Fitness advice and her bodybuilding and that kind of thing her bodybuilding and that kind of thing her bodybuilding and that kind of thing elanar Roosevelt says do something that elanar Roosevelt says do something that elanar Roosevelt says do something that scares you every day because that's the scares you every day because that's the scares you every day because that's the key to personal growth that's the key to key to personal growth that's the key to key to personal growth that's the key to facing these challenges without letting facing these challenges without letting facing these challenges without letting your catastrophic mind take over
now she finds that she's incapable of now she finds that she's incapable of having kids some women in that situation having kids some women in that situation having kids some women in that situation feel cheated feel lied to because their feel cheated feel lied to because their feel cheated feel lied to because their fertility has been declining at this fertility has been declining at this fertility has been declining at this accelerated rate that is analogous to accelerated rate that is analogous to accelerated rate that is analogous to the decline in testosterone levels among the decline in testosterone levels among the decline in testosterone levels among young men what can they do the most young men what can they do the most young men what can they do the most metabolically demanding thing that any metabolically demanding thing that any metabolically demanding thing that any human has probably ever done is human has probably ever done is human has probably ever done is pregnancy pregnancy is a physiological pregnancy pregnancy is a physiological pregnancy pregnancy is a physiological state of insulin resistance not
and that the ovaries will no longer and that the ovaries will no longer ovulate and that there can be low tea in ovulate and that there can be low tea in ovulate and that there can be low tea in women and there are no FDA approved women and there are no FDA approved women and there are no FDA approved testosterone therapies for women in the testosterone therapies for women in the testosterone therapies for women in the United States and that means a clinician United States and that means a clinician United States and that means a clinician who wants to treat a woman for low tea who wants to treat a woman for low tea who wants to treat a woman for low tea has to adapt a male protocol which to me has to adapt a male protocol which to me has to adapt a male protocol which to me makes no sense they're they're really makes no sense they're they're really makes no sense they're they're really they're making it up as they go along they're making it up as they go along they're making it up as they go along and I'm not saying it can't help but it and I'm not saying it can't help but it and I'm not saying it can't help but it has to be done under the careful
women with testosterone therapy is low women with testosterone therapy is low libido when the woman feels that libido when the woman feels that libido when the woman feels that testosterone boost she's going to feel a testosterone boost she's going to feel a testosterone boost she's going to feel a boost in her sex drive and so a lot of boost in her sex drive and so a lot of boost in her sex drive and so a lot of things happen when a woman starts things happen when a woman starts things happen when a woman starts practicing cold water therapy she's practicing cold water therapy she's practicing cold water therapy she's fixing her metabolism which will improve fixing her metabolism which will improve fixing her metabolism which will improve her her her fertility she's uh likely but we don't fertility she's uh likely but we don't fertility she's uh likely but we don't know for sure stimulating testosterone know for sure stimulating testosterone know for sure stimulating testosterone production which will improve her sex
shoot she used to be a runway model this shoot she used to be a runway model this is perfect right we're going to promote is perfect right we're going to promote is perfect right we're going to promote the ice bath and it's going to be good the ice bath and it's going to be good the ice bath and it's going to be good for morasco and S is such a beautiful for morasco and S is such a beautiful for morasco and S is such a beautiful backdrop and we had such an argument backdrop and we had such an argument backdrop and we had such an argument like the day before that we're supposed like the day before that we're supposed like the day before that we're supposed to drive up there and my daughter is to drive up there and my daughter is to drive up there and my daughter is supposed to be the videographer and my supposed to be the videographer and my supposed to be the videographer and my daughter doesn't even ride with me right daughter doesn't even ride with me right daughter doesn't even ride with me right because I'm all full of resentments and because I'm all full of resentments and because I'm all full of resentments and I'm angry and stuff but we're going to
your partner will also increase your partner will also increase vasopressin and oxytocin these are vasopressin and oxytocin these are vasopressin and oxytocin these are bonding hormones so Helen Fischer writes bonding hormones so Helen Fischer writes bonding hormones so Helen Fischer writes about the three brain systems of love about the three brain systems of love about the three brain systems of love lust romance like having a crush on lust romance like having a crush on lust romance like having a crush on someone and familial attachment that someone and familial attachment that someone and familial attachment that oxytocin bonding that that we can oxytocin bonding that that we can oxytocin bonding that that we can experience with a pet or with a baby or experience with a pet or with a baby or experience with a pet or with a baby or with a sibling so she says you know with a sibling so she says you know with a sibling so she says you know human beings are capable these three human beings are capable these three human beings are capable these three different systems of love the word love
especially shared physiological States especially shared physiological States is what you want to try and experience is what you want to try and experience is what you want to try and experience with a with the partner different with a with the partner different with a with the partner different experiences outside the house but again experiences outside the house but again experiences outside the house but again like it's pretty hard to not share the like it's pretty hard to not share the like it's pretty hard to not share the sh same physiological state in in an ice sh same physiological state in in an ice sh same physiological state in in an ice bar Thomas I want to be respectful your bar Thomas I want to be respectful your bar Thomas I want to be respectful your time I know coming up to the hour what time I know coming up to the hour what time I know coming up to the hour what what would you say to someone who hasn't what would you say to someone who hasn't what would you say to someone who hasn't tried cold water exposure um I know it tried cold water exposure um I know it tried cold water exposure um I know it was a big sort of catalyst for your own
know saying breath [ __ ] like know saying breath [ __ ] like there is no coercion in our method there there is no coercion in our method there there is no coercion in our method there is no bullying in our method you get in is no bullying in our method you get in is no bullying in our method you get in and out of your own valtion and so she and out of your own valtion and so she and out of your own valtion and so she developed her own method and she developed her own method and she developed her own method and she developed the catchphrase this is what developed the catchphrase this is what developed the catchphrase this is what cold feels like her approach was take cold feels like her approach was take cold feels like her approach was take all the emotion down calm yourself don't all the emotion down calm yourself don't all the emotion down calm yourself don't let anybody push you into it or talk you let anybody push you into it or talk you let anybody push you into it or talk you into it when you get in get in like you into it when you get in get in like you into it when you get in get in like you are a king or a queen of your own
Baseline of what seems to be stressful Baseline of what seems to be stressful and things that previously would have and things that previously would have and things that previously would have stress me out a bit less so feel calmer stress me out a bit less so feel calmer stress me out a bit less so feel calmer feel I'm enjoying life a bit more but I feel I'm enjoying life a bit more but I feel I'm enjoying life a bit more but I always enjoy life as well but just uh always enjoy life as well but just uh always enjoy life as well but just uh amplifying it even further um Thomas one amplifying it even further um Thomas one amplifying it even further um Thomas one last question for you which is uh last question for you which is uh last question for you which is uh inspired by a CH it's not my question inspired by a CH it's not my question inspired by a CH it's not my question but I feel I should probably credit him but I feel I should probably credit him but I feel I should probably credit him Patrick shus he asks what's the kindest Patrick shus he asks what's the kindest Patrick shus he asks what's the kindest thing anyone's ever done for you we're
cried like a baby and I didn't even know cried like a baby and I didn't even know why except I had to process it later and why except I had to process it later and why except I had to process it later and realize that there was some deficit in realize that there was some deficit in realize that there was some deficit in my childhood now in that moment she my childhood now in that moment she my childhood now in that moment she could have judged me she could have said could have judged me she could have said could have judged me she could have said well he's crazy or she could have said well he's crazy or she could have said well he's crazy or she could have said well he's weak well he's vulnerable like well he's weak well he's vulnerable like well he's weak well he's vulnerable like a lot of fears going through my mind a lot of fears going through my mind a lot of fears going through my mind about how this display is sure to kill about how this display is sure to kill about how this display is sure to kill like her attraction to me and none of like her attraction to me and none of like her attraction to me and none of that happened instead um she appreciated
you were just then so massive uh yeah you were just then so massive uh yeah very uh very much admire that I think very uh very much admire that I think very uh very much admire that I think was a beautiful answer I'm pleased I ask was a beautiful answer I'm pleased I ask was a beautiful answer I'm pleased I ask the question the um I want to be the question the um I want to be the question the um I want to be respectful for your time and know we respectful for your time and know we respectful for your time and know we come out to the hour um is there any come out to the hour um is there any come out to the hour um is there any partying thoughts you'd like to give to partying thoughts you'd like to give to partying thoughts you'd like to give to our listeners or any words of advice or our listeners or any words of advice or our listeners or any words of advice or anything you'd like to end on where can anything you'd like to end on where can anything you'd like to end on where can where can people find you as well well where can people find you as well well where can people find you as well well let me tell you what I'm uh working on
once in a while I follow him on Twitter once in a while I follow him on Twitter and I don't understand 80% of what that and I don't understand 80% of what that and I don't understand 80% of what that man says but the 20% is so helpful in man says but the 20% is so helpful in man says but the 20% is so helpful in guiding my own research that I can't I guiding my own research that I can't I guiding my own research that I can't I can't stop trying to figure him out and can't stop trying to figure him out and can't stop trying to figure him out and he's been talking about light and cold he's been talking about light and cold he's been talking about light and cold for a lot longer than I have and the way for a lot longer than I have and the way for a lot longer than I have and the way that they interact so I'm going to leave that they interact so I'm going to leave that they interact so I'm going to leave you with this thought that I'm working you with this thought that I'm working you with this thought that I'm working on vitamin D is essential to your on vitamin D is essential to your on vitamin D is essential to your metabolic health and to your immune
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Brown Fat, Mitochondria, and the Metabolic Stakes
Not all fat is equal. White fat stores energy but contains almost no mitochondria — it is a warehouse, not an engine. Brown fat cells hold thousands of mitochondria, and each mitochondrion carries its own DNA, a biological signature of ancient origins. The purpose of brown fat is singular: to convert stored energy directly into heat, driving a cascade of metabolic activity that keeps the body's systems in balance and its energy conversion functioning with precision.
When cold exposure is absent and brown fat sits dormant, metabolism slowly disregulates. Insulin resistance develops; without the activation signal that cold provides, the downstream risks accumulate — type 2 diabetes, Alzheimer's disease, cardiovascular deterioration. These are slow-moving but eventual consequences of never getting cold, of allowing the metabolic machinery to go unchallenged and, in time, unreliable. The pathway from never getting cold to serious illness is not sudden; it is gradual, quiet, and preventable.
anything above that is like bathwater — it's just boring
These conditions are not merely metabolic in the conventional sense — they are mitochondrial. Alzheimer's disease is associated with impaired mitochondrial function in neural tissue; heart disease follows the same underlying pattern of cellular energy failure. Cold water exposure addresses the upstream driver rather than the downstream symptoms, prompting the body to restore the energy infrastructure that makes cognitive clarity and cardiovascular resilience possible.
Cold exposure stimulates mitochondrial biogenesis — the creation of new mitochondria within existing cells and the expansion of the mitochondrial population overall. More mitochondria means more metabolic capacity, better energy conversion, and a cellular environment that performs younger than its chronological age. Seager describes the result plainly: aging in reverse, at least biologically speaking. The phrase reflects the actual trajectory of a body continuously prompted to repair and rebuild rather than passively declining year by year.
Acclimation shifts the threshold entirely. For someone unaccustomed to cold, 15°C feels extreme; for the adapted body, it barely registers. Seager's personal threshold sits around 6–7°C — roughly 40°F — below which the stimulus remains genuine. Anything above that, he says, is bathwater: familiar enough to produce no meaningful adaptation. This shift is not a sign that the protocol has stopped working. It is evidence that it already has, the body having expanded its range of equilibrium.
The embodied proof arrived at a conference in Rovaniemi, Finland — the closest Seager had come to the Arctic Circle, a city whose airport displays celebrate proximity to the North Pole with the gravity of established fact. He arrived in December with almost nothing for the cold: just a scarf. While colleagues layered against the Finnish winter, he moved through it at ease, his body calibrated to temperatures that others found intolerable. It was not performance or stubbornness. It was adaptation, made plainly visible.
The metabolic stakes, understood clearly, reframe cold exposure from a wellness trend to a biological requirement. Diseases once categorized as inevitable features of aging — metabolic decline, cognitive deterioration, cardiovascular fragility — are increasingly understood as consequences of mitochondrial dysfunction. Cold is one of the few accessible tools capable of prompting the body to rebuild at the cellular level, restoring the metabolic function that modern sedentary warmth has systematically eroded. That is not a modest claim. It is a precise one.
Hormones, Fertility, and the Cold-Then-Exercise Protocol
The hormonal benefits of cold arrived for Seager as an accident. In his early fifties, having already lost significant weight and begun exploring cold exposure partly for prostate health, he discovered something unexpected: his testosterone was rising. He had not set out to optimize his endocrine system. He had been trying to stay healthy without submitting to the aggressive medical interventions whose complications — infection, incontinence, lasting dysfunction — had frightened him when he researched what conventional prostate treatment actually looked like.
The research that explained what he was experiencing compared two protocols directly: cold water immersion before a cycling session, and cold water immersion after. The before-group showed rising testosterone and rising luteinizing hormone. The after-group showed both declining. When the sequence was reversed, the result reversed too — clean, measurable, consistent. Something in the cold was priming the endocrine system; movement was completing the signal, not initiating it.
Luteinizing hormone is the signal the pituitary sends to the gonads, instructing them to produce testosterone through the body's own mechanisms. High luteinizing hormone is confirmation that the system is self-regulating, not being supplemented from outside. Take exogenous testosterone — TRT, anabolic steroids, any synthetic hormone — and that signal drops to near zero because the brain stops issuing an instruction the body appears already to be receiving. Seager's luteinizing hormone is elevated, confirming that what he experiences is entirely self-generated.
I don't want to be normal, Ben — I want to be better than normal
His lab reports now flag him as abnormal. He rejects the designation. The reference ranges for testosterone are calculated from the general population — a population experiencing widespread metabolic dysfunction. To calibrate a health goal to the average of a metabolically compromised baseline is to aim at precisely the wrong target. His position is direct: he does not want to be normal. He wants to be better than normal, which requires a different standard entirely.
The parallel with female fertility is exact and underappreciated. As testosterone declines in men, female fertility declines in women — both trends accelerating in recent decades, both likely connected to the same underlying metabolic disregulation. Pregnancy is among the most metabolically demanding physiological states a human body can enter; a body already compromised by insulin resistance is not equipped for it. Cold exposure improves metabolic function, and research suggests it stimulates testosterone production in women as well, though without FDA-approved testosterone therapies for women, clinicians are largely adapting male protocols with limited guidance and uncertain results.
The protocol itself does not require extreme output. A brisk walk, jumping rope, or light kettlebell work immediately after cold immersion is enough to trigger the hormonal response. Cold primes the system; movement completes the signal. Some avoid exercise after cold out of concern that contracted muscles will be more vulnerable to injury — a concern worth acknowledging, though not yet documented in the available research. The principle stands: cold followed by movement produces a hormonal environment the body was built to sustain.
Facing Fear, Building Bonds
Cold water teaches one lesson with uncommon clarity: your fears are smaller than you believe. Every session that begins with reluctance — the moment of standing at the edge, building a case for delay — ends the same way. You get in. The catastrophes your mind was constructing do not materialize. What you find instead is presence: sharp, undeniable, and entirely incompatible with the background noise of catastrophic thinking.
Joseph Campbell described the dynamic before the ice bath became a practice: "The cave you fear to enter holds the treasure you seek." Seager has internalized this as a personal discipline. Every morning the mind constructs a plausible argument for skipping — and every morning that resistance is recognized as the signal itself. The cave is there; the discomfort is the door. What waits on the other side is a clarity and stillness that cannot be purchased; it must be earned through the doing.
His wife developed her own approach: no coercion, no performance framing, no encouragement to push harder or stay longer. Her philosophy distilled to a single phrase — "this is what cold feels like" — designed to strip the emotional charge and encounter the experience as information rather than ordeal. Cold is not an opponent; it is a condition. Her guidance was simple: get in like a king, or like a queen. Own the choice, and let the experience begin from there.
Sharing the ice changes its texture entirely. Cold exposure alongside a partner elevates oxytocin and vasopressin — bonding hormones associated with trust, attachment, and the deepened connection that sustains long relationships. The anthropologist Helen Fischer mapped three distinct brain systems involved in love: lust, romantic attraction, and the familial attachment built through shared experience and mutual care. Cold water, entered together, activates something in all three; the shared physiological state creates a quality of presence and vulnerability that is difficult to replicate in ordinary circumstances. The ice bath, shared, becomes something beyond recovery.
In the ice, vulnerability surfaces without warning. Seager has cried there, processing something without an outlet and without fully understanding why until afterward. His wife's response was not judgment — not a measure of weakness against her expectations — but simple, unhesitating presence. What most men fear they will lose by being seen in that state is, in that moment, precisely what deepens the bond. The ice holds no script; it removes performance and leaves what was always there.
cried like a baby and I didn't even know why
The cold does not cause vulnerability; it removes the insulation that keeps it hidden. That quality — the stripping away of managed presentation, the forced arrival into now — is not a side effect of the practice. It is one of its most important features. His current research frontier is the interaction between vitamin D, cold, and light, an area where the science is still assembling itself and one that tends to reward those willing to enter the unknown before the answers are clear.
